( – promoted by buhdydharma )
We might as well start this new phase from the very beginning, lol. And work our way up and/or down to where these questions will finally lead, to the Human behavior that culminates in what we call politics. These questions of course have no scientifically objective answers, the only answers can be….beliefs. But human beliefs are what shape our world
Some people believe that Freedom, Equality, and Justice for all are the most important things. Others believe that Power, Money, and Control of others are the most important things. These two belief systems are, and always have been the source of all conflict for humans. First in our huts, then our villages then our cities our nations and now in the 21st century, on the planetary scale.
So there are no final answers to these questions, no right or wrong answers. The only purpose in asking them is to discuss our beliefs. Because again, those focused beliefs, when acted on, are the basis of all human society.
“What the most people believe” is as close as we can get to something called reality or truth, when it comes to human behavior. As “what the most people believe” changes over time, as it always has…the world changes. And we all want to change the world.
So let’s start at the beginning!
1) What is the Universe?
1a) Is it an “accident?” Just random phenomenon?
1b) Or does it have a purpose? Or if it was just random phenomenon at it’s inception, has a purpose evolved?
2) Supposing it has one, (since if it doesn’t and it is just random phenomenon, there is really no further discussion necessary or possible) what is the purpose of the universe?
3) Is the creation of Planet Earth just a random phenomenon of the greater universe?
3a) If not, what part of the (presumed) purpose of the universe did the creation of the Planet Earth serve?
4) Is the creation of Human Beings just a random phenomenon of the Planet Earth?
4a) If not, what part of the (presumed) purpose of the universe did the creation of the Human Beings serve?
Note: The (presumed) existence of “a purpose” in no way presumes exactly what/who that purpose serves or belongs to. It does presume some sort of organized consciousness or intelligence. It does presume how organized or focused that consciousness or intelligence is…for instance, it certainly does not presume that that consciousness or intelligence is organized into an man with a white beard on a golden throne in the clouds, lol. It is, imho, distinctly unnecessary for the (presumed) consciousness or intelligence of the universe to be focused into any central, heavily organized, or embodied state or condition that could be described as “god” or gods.
Final caveat for the discussion; if there is anything impossible at all in the universe, this is it….that tiny little pieces of the universe like human beings could ever really, finally, to the point of unquestioning declaration know understand or accurately describe the consciousness/intelligence that we perhaps posses a tiny little infinitesimal spark of. Certainly not to the point of insisting, dictating, or controlling other Human Beings with our “superior knowledge.”
Within what could be called a rational framework, (which imo is pretty elastic) there is no right or wrong. There are only beliefs. Beliefs that change the world as more people adopt or abandon them. When the number of people in a village, or society, or nation, or on a planet adopt a belief reaches a critical mass of agreement or focused consciousness, that belief then becomes “true.”
Decisions are then made based on that shared belief, on that “truth.” Paradigms are built around it. New, shared, focused beliefs create new realities, and thus new worlds.
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Every experiment in the LHC will create a new one. Only, much, much tinier.
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to really, really, really, insecure people. But they would never admit to that motivation.
an illusion?
That, essentially, along with ideas of God, which is centered in the brain, the ego essentially exists out of a mere evolutionary imperative to keep us alive to reproduce?
After all, our atoms survive, and there is the global organism. How important is one’s ego, except as a self reinforcing evolved mental process of no particular significance except the continuation of the organism for no other purpose than perpetuating the species?
the ascension mechanics of December 21, 2012 and gain that enhanced DNA structure to harness the fifth dimension then you might be OK. Otherwise earth crosses the galactic center, is thus at the focal point of undocumented energy from the entire electromagnetic spectrum causing N/S pole reversal, earth core shifting putting Maine on the equator and tidal waves wiping out all living things on earth.
Well, that’s dim you might say but. The secret space program and the intergalactic alliance has been working on this phenomena for the last 60 years with mixed results but they simply can’t tell us peasants who appear to them as blissful ignorant cows complete with bar codes attached to our ears. Most happy with Lady GaGa or the Kardashian brats contemplating stuff like the universe just isn’t an option.
I cant believe you started without me! lol But dinner was goooood.
uhm.
God… “God”… is a convenient shorthand. God doesnt have an ego. God doesnt need us or anyone to ‘worship’ him/ her/ it in the ways that were being taught when I was growing up. God is not the ultimate Them (Him) in the Us v Them absolute division. We are god and god is us and its not just us humans. Any ‘purpose” is …well… hard to discuss outside the frame of a “Him/Her” anthropomorphisized persona…. that some think we have to appeal to or petition or appease. etc.
Inseparable we are.
Time and space are illusion. Linear time… the idea that ‘Im born, I live, I die, and maybe I go to heaven or some such…’ no. Its a continuum. Again, convenient frame to help in comprehension and discussion. But “God” is … unfathomable. So why try to “read his mind” when you know he doesnt really even have a mind in the way that we think. ha ha.
Purpose… the purpose is equally unfathomable. Ultimate. Truth. Essence. Unity. Pure love. In spirit, both in and beyond this existence. It is its own purpose.
It is … whether you acknowledge it or not, whether you comprehend it or not…. whether you ‘sing his praises’ or not. Live it, do it, be it, and it will be.
Im terribly reactionary … sorry. But really, most people really screw it up. lol.
Ill be visiting my evangelical relatives in a couple of weeks. Im trying to psyche up. lol. John 14 is a lot of fun.
To these questions…
I say… what difference does it make… if I know or understand the intricacies of it? Does the Answer alter the prime directive belief that we should Love One Another…?
The Power/Control believers are just… wrong. And they will be their own demise.
Can they take me down with them in the process? Kill me? Oppress me? Sure. But not really, not in the greater context of … The Universe. Partially because “me” …the sense of Self… is another manifest illusion, in some ways.
sigh.
Did I wander off? lol
Back on Earth…:)
I believe the air shouldn’t be so polluted it gives me a headache and I believe that I should be able to gulp down as much of it as I need to keep walking my dog as long as she and I want to until one of us dies and finds out what the hell is out there.
Also, where do the children play?
Who’s with me?
Numero Uno is like an eternity for us.
I believe that much of the universe is quite random, and that we people here on Terra are accidental to an extent.
On the other hand, doing the calculus to derive life from nonlife is sort of difficult. Although I do not believe in a deity as proffered (the second time this evening that I have used that word) by the major religions, something happened to increase the complexity of inorganic materials until they became self replicating, one of the definitions of life.
My biggest problem is with creation itself. I find the traditional religious explanations wanting, because they all require some sort of a preexisting being to make it happen, and that begs the question of “So whence came that being?”. The Big Bang is not very much better, because I have, as a scientist, a problem with something from nothing.
I also think that the “scientific” explanations are wanting for that same reason. Some hypotheses say that our universe is a result of collisions between membranes of polyspace, but I think that this is pure conjecture. In reality, we just do not know, and likely never will.
Science is the distillation of centuries of the application of logic, experimentation, and modeling. I am not sure that either science or religion can explain the creation of our universe. Perhaps it is better that some questions have imponderable answers.
Thank you you allowing me to post here.
Warmest regards,
Doc
Perhaps the only purpose is for us to ask these questions of ourselves long enough to realize that these questions (and these types of question in general) are unanswerable and that the pursuit of THE answers to them is folly and waste and that believing we have arrived at any answer for them at all is pure hubris – raising ourselves above the supposed god or gods that we fancifully create in the face of Inexplicable Reality…
Perhaps we can approach the answers to the big questions through observing reality, but I am not prone to believe that all the underpinnings of reality are knowable by us. And if they are, what then? The same questions are still there…
The only conclusion that seems available to me with any certainty at all is that something is somehow preferred over nothing. Why or how? – Can’t say…
The closest I have found to anyone building a framework of understanding and reason for action based on what I think is The Church of Reality.
Given that the Universe exists at all, I do not think that there is any such thing as a truly “random” event within it. All “laws” of the Universe conspire to produce us. This may be derisively called ‘anthropomorphic’ by some, but to me it is simply a recognition of reality as best as we know it. Most of what passes for ‘random accident’ is constrained and proscribed by the laws of reality. Mathematic/scientific chaos theory shows us that ‘random’ events in the Universe are controlled by attractors, or sets of possible outcomes which are not free to be totally random. A random event within constraints is not purely accident, and may be understood as a preferred outcome of a system of mathematical/physical rules.
At least, that’s my current state of thought…
never thought i’d figure it out and still don’t.
“The Universe” is a story, a construction. It is not real or unreal. According to my study of Vedanta and Buddhism and my own experience, the only reality that means anything or that you can count on is that point of awareness we all seem to share. Everything else is hearsay or a story created out of various stimulus-response events. Speculating about the Universe or God as something external leads nowhere. This moment this point of awareness is the only reality and everything else is interesting and diverting speculation.
Abracadabraoozematazz; we’ve finally made it to the inner sanctum of our great vegetable pyramid. Gotta keep those worms out though.
the Universe is just
a bad dream, God was having,
one eon.
And we, the fleeting characters,
that just keep flipping through,
that 2-Dimensional Cartoon notepad.
Our Purpose: to find out “the Punchlines”,
of God’s not so obvious jokes.
I guess, we need to hear em over and over,
again before we get it.
there’s no place like home.
home is where your heart is.
and finally,
the greatest things, start from
the smallest of ideas.
Get planting!
And as the great sage of Pink Floyd, once exclaimed:
And I’m still waiting!
I think the consensus is there’s not much point to speculating about the universe and what its purpose is.
The important question I think is whether each individual human realizes his/her own purpose and actualizes it.
I think we are all born out of One, the ONE, whether that’s god or the universe or whatever you call it. I tend to think about it as the cosmic or universal consciousness. While we’re here it is up to each one of us to come to that self-awareness to recognize our purpose and try to fulfill it. The self actualization may be as simple (or complicated) as recognition that we are all part of the One, the unity of all things, and that’s what we return to.
Sometimes I think we’re all evolving to become that one – and that even our technological advances, ie internet, instant communication, are hastening that unity ( I realize that lot’s’ of souls now living will not make it to this realization/actualization.)
How this moves us to real change in how we live, I understand, is the question – or how to help make that change. Again, I think it all starts with the individual and how we each one choose to live, the life choices we make. Being close to the earth, and learning nature’s ways, is the key.